#581 Bob's Your Uncle

Sasha is Australian, in her mid 20s and has been living with type one diabetes since she was young.

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DISCLAIMER: This text is the output of AI based transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors and should not be treated as an authoritative record. Nothing that you read here constitutes advice medical or otherwise. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making changes to a healthcare plan.

Scott Benner 0:00
Hello Friends Hello friends Hello friends Hello friends hello friends. Hello darkness my old friend

Hello friends and welcome to episode 581 of the Juicebox Podcast. On today's show, I'll be speaking with Sasha, who is Australian in her mid 20s and has been living with type one diabetes since she was a young person. While you're listening, please remember that nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan or becoming bold with insulin. I want to remind you to check out the private Facebook group it is completely free always will be Juicebox Podcast type one diabetes over 17,000 members. The diabetes pro tip and defining diabetes episodes are fan favorites. If you're looking for management ideas about type one diabetes, check out diabetes pro tip.com. Have you considered filling out the survey AT T one D exchange.org. Forward slash juicebox? Well, if you have type one diabetes, or you're the caregiver of someone with type one, and you're a US citizen, you can it'll just take a few minutes. And with that very little bit of effort you will have helped someone with type one diabetes

this show is sponsored today by the glucagon that my daughter carries G voc hypo Penn Find out more at G voc glucagon.com. Forward slash Juicebox. Podcast is also sponsored by the Contour Next One blood glucose meter. You can find out more at contour next one.com forward slash juicebox.

Sasha 1:57
Okay, so my name is Sasha, I'm 25 years old. I live in Melbourne, Australia, and I have type one diabetes.

Scott Benner 2:07
I'm so happy for how many people in Australia listened to the podcast. So it's exciting to me. How did you find Yeah,

Sasha 2:16
I heard quite a few episodes recently with Australians on there. And that was surprised as well.

Scott Benner 2:22
Yeah, I am. I mean, the first time I was just like, oh, this is neat. Didn't mean like it was like, I don't know, finding an ice cream flavor I'd never seen before. But then, you know, the second and the third time that people actually wanted to be on and watching the downloads in the country. It's a I think it's one of the top three countries for the podcast. So it's always very consistent. You guys are always very nice to me. So thank you.

Sasha 2:47
For Thank you. No, please,

Scott Benner 2:49
don't be silly. I was just gonna forget the first time that someone contacted me and said they needed help or something. And we're wondering if we could talk and I said, Yeah, sure. Like, you know, here's my number. And she's like, I can't call it's too expensive. And I was like, where are you? And she said, Australia, and we ended up doing it through FaceTime audio, I think. Which was surprisingly good. Like, is that how you? Do you guys do that? A lot

Sasha 3:18
of you? No, no, not really. I mean, I think over he is mostly just WhatsApp, WhatsApp. Gotcha. Yeah, I think that's the common on.

Scott Benner 3:29
Okay. And so is it just incredibly expensive to make a phone call?

Sasha 3:35
I mean, if you if you're calling from overseas, or making a phone call to overseas then yes, but not not within the country?

Scott Benner 3:43
No. Oh, yeah. I didn't think you lived on Mars like I was. So tell me about when you were diagnosed? How old are you?

Sasha 3:53
I was nine, nine.

Scott Benner 3:56
She saved 25. Now? Yes. Be prepared to be really impressed. Was that 16 years ago? How long 1718 2020 230 My God. I am on top of things this morning. So a very long time ago. And while you were living in Australia?

Sasha 4:14
No, actually, I was living in France.

Scott Benner 4:17
How does that happen? Tell me more about that.

Sasha 4:20
So my dad is Australian and my mom is fresh. I was born in Australia, but I grew up in France. So from the age of three to 18, I was living in France, so I was actually diagnosed in Switzerland. Were your

Scott Benner 4:36
parents together? Yes. Okay. That makes it more interesting that you're back in Australia. Like I want to ask more questions, but I also feel like it's going to come out during the story. I don't know where to go with this. Alright, let's just let's start there, where we're in France that you live

Sasha 4:54
right next to the Swiss border. So just on the other side of Geneva.

Scott Benner 4:59
Okay. Hey. And so your, your parents, where did they get together?

Sasha 5:06
They met in France in my dad was working over there when he was younger

Scott Benner 5:11
was working. Okay. Periscope, how were they young when they got married?

Sasha 5:17
Um, I think they're in the early 30s.

Scott Benner 5:21
That's Do you think that's yeah.

Sasha 5:26
I mean, yes and no. It's like, I feel like if you ask an 18 year old is 30 Young, they'll be like now that's old. But I'm 25 and I'm starting to cross over there. I feel like it's not that old.

Scott Benner 5:42
guy wasn't asking you to defend your own fear about getting old. I was trying to figure out this 30 was old to you. Are you nervous?

Sasha 5:51
Uh, I was a little bit at first, but yeah,

Scott Benner 5:54
you're good. Okay. Excellent. Yes. Great. Yeah. I don't want you to be nervous. So, alright, so you're a young kid. You're growing up the entire time, I guess in Geneva. And or right by Geneva. You said? Yeah. Okay. Do you speak French? Yes, I do. Like rock solid. If you went over there, people wouldn't be like, that's an Australian girl pretending to be French

Sasha 6:15
like, yeah. Wow. Yeah. They wouldn't be able to tell. That's so

Scott Benner 6:20
cool. So I'm gonna depress you just very quickly. Okay, turn the lights off. It's time to go to bed.

Sasha 6:28
You want me to say that in French? Yeah. Do it. Italian Yeah. That is pushy.

Scott Benner 6:35
I don't think he had time to Google that. So that sounds pretty legitimate. Okay. So, okay, so you grow up? Were you strictly French speaking or does your dad speak French?

Sasha 6:46
He does. But most of the time I speak French with my mom in English with my dad.

Scott Benner 6:50
That's so cool. I don't think you imagine that as being otter, like in an interesting way. But it is. I mean, to me at least I think that's pretty amazing. Alright, so were you diagnosed in French? Yes, I was. Excellent. Did that have any impact on it? Because I asked the person recently if they were diagnosed in Spanish, and she felt like it had an impact. Meaning that once she reached English speech, speaking, doctors, they were more specific with her. I don't know why she thought that. But I'm asking you because she said that.

Sasha 7:26
I'm not in that sense. But I think that when I want to move to Australia, when I was 18, I then I think just the transition was strange. With everything, not just diabetes, just learning how to, you know, just learning the slang in another language. Like I knew the language, but I didn't know how to talk about diabetes in English.

Scott Benner 7:51
Oh, that's interesting. So is that would that mostly become an issue between you and a physician? Are you want to parent Where did that?

Sasha 8:03
Probably mostly physician physicians. Okay. Yeah.

Scott Benner 8:07
Did you? Did you find the physicians helpful? And are they more helpful in one country than the other? I think that'd be about the same. The same. Yeah. Was it helpful?

Sasha 8:22
Not particularly North.

Scott Benner 8:26
Australia's where King Kong lives, right? Uh, what? What do you mean, the giant gorilla that came to New York in the 40s and took that woman up to the top of the Empire spa?

Sasha 8:43
He was Australia.

Scott Benner 8:44
I don't know why it's not. But I imagine in my mind that it is so bad. Yeah. Because I mean, you have the giant spiders already. So I swear to you that I think it might be genetic. Because if you asked me, Do you want to go to Australia? I'd be like, Yes, that sounds amazing. What about the giant spiders? Am I gonna be okay, would be my next question. I don't think I've ever said that out loud in front of anybody. And my son who's 21 And you know, travels way more than I did when he was younger. When I was younger. Somebody asked him about Australia the other day and he said, What about this fight? Are they just everywhere? The way I imagined just are they on the roof of your like house and crawling through your living room right now and everything?

Sasha 9:27
Probably, but I don't think that's because there's more spiders in Australia. I think that's just because insulation here is terrible. And this, you know, cracks underneath underneath the doors. So the spine has come in.

Scott Benner 9:39
No kidding. It's a construction issue you believe. Yeah, yeah, pretty much. Are you calling out Australians right now and their construction practices? Oh, yeah. No kidding. That's interesting. I know you're being a little funny, but I think you mean it. So.

Sasha 9:55
Oh, yeah, I definitely mean that.

Scott Benner 9:59
Are your doors square Are they like swing? Well, or do they get stuck? Or is it that bad?

Sasha 10:05
I don't I don't know what the what the deal is. But it's just it's just not good.

Scott Benner 10:12
That's hilarious. All right. So you said in your note that you left the hospital in France with a pump? Yes, I did. So you know, you've never done injections. Sorry, have you ever done MDI injections?

Sasha 10:29
I have. But I saw I, I went on a pump immediately. And then, probably about seven or eight years later, I got sick of the pump. And then I started MDI, but I hadn't actually, I had actually never done an injection in the hospital. Or maybe I had, but like they're in a teddy bear or an orange or something.

Scott Benner 10:50
So it's an interesting, so you use the pump exclusively for I mean, a long time into your into your mid late teens. Right? And then you just decide I'm not wearing a pump anymore. Was it? Like a harrowing experience to give yourself an injection the first time?

Sasha 11:09
Yeah, kind of, yeah, I've kind of felt like a warrior. I remember, I mean that they were probably a few times while I was on a pump, where I had to give myself an injection, you know, from failed sites or whatnot. But I had always relied on my parents to do that, because I was always too scared. Yeah, but I decided to come off it because I, you know, being a teenager, I just didn't like having to, you know, having the pump connected to me all the time and having it visible by other people. And I think I was also never really taught how to use it properly. So I'm sorry. Now, I didn't understand, you know, Temp Basal rules and things like that. Gotcha. So you're encouraged to use those.

Scott Benner 12:02
So the pump for you was basically just a way to not have to give injections all day long. And, yeah, pretty much. What kind of pump? Was it back then?

Sasha 12:13
A, one of the early maytronics.

Scott Benner 12:16
Gotcha. And are you MDI right now as I'm talking to you?

Sasha 12:21
No, I have a Medtronic pump. That is actually weirdly looking. It's very similar to the one I have left the hospital with that diagnosis. Because it's the only one that is loopable in Australia.

Scott Benner 12:37
Okay, now we're getting to it. How long did you inject?

Sasha 12:45
From what I was, like, 16, and two to three years ago,

Scott Benner 12:53
what made you switch back?

Sasha 12:56
I'm actually listening to your podcast and reading the reading a bunch of books about diabetes, essentially, and learning that there's a lot more you can do with pumps, then I had probably previously thought,

Scott Benner 13:13
huh, well hold on a second. Well, I talked directly to Medtronic in case they're listening. See, there, I sold one for you. It wasn't like usual when people come on and say I hate my Medtronic pump this one much better for you guys. Right. You know, they're listening. Anyway. That's nice. So you wanted to loop? Yes. Gotcha. And you can't get on the pods in Australia? No. Right. Am I understanding now? Yes, excellent. Okay. So you find the podcast a couple of years ago? Would you consider your management much different today than it was two years ago? Or did you begin to work in a different way? Even sooner than that?

Sasha 13:54
I think I had. Well, growing up, I think my doctors always told me, I was doing a great job. And I think, I think mainly because I was, you know, I wasn't purposely not bolusing or anything like that. I think my agency back then Well, it's probably like, in the 80s or so. Like, it wasn't terrible, but it wasn't amazing either. And then, and then I started becoming more interested in learning about it. I think I probably saw found a couple of groups on Facebook, around diabetes. And then I started listening to your podcast and reading books and just being more interested in knowing more about it because I feel like I had I hadn't been taught really the basics. And so after that, my A once he came way down, and I started reading the book by Gary Schneider. Yep. And so I discovered I found your podcast around that time. And so I think reading the book and listening to you talk about similar ideas kind of helped cement it all together. And essentially, I think the podcast was a bit of a daily reminder of, you know, don't forget to Pre-Bolus sort of thing.

Scott Benner 15:22
Gotcha. That's really cool. I, when I hear people talk about that, that makes me happy. Because that's a that's an impact from the podcast that I did not imagine when I was making it. But I hear from people a lot about just adults living with type one who just need to be reminded and need to hear it over and over and don't have somebody to talk to about I mean, who really, you don't I mean, like, even if you had like a best friend with diabetes, you wouldn't talk about diabetes every day. So that's really cool. Can I ask you something? Do you see because you're in an interesting space, you're in your mid 20s. So you've crested How do I say this? There's this part of life. Like when you took off your pump until when you decided to probably pay closer attention in that space. That's a real like, teenage rebellion. Space, right? Like, it's, it's not uncommon. It's not like you're, you're the only one that it happened to, although you wouldn't think of it that way at the time, but when you were like, I don't want to wear this pump. You wouldn't like have a conscious thought, like, I'm 16. And I'm rebelling against something. Just you know, you just feel like I don't want this pump. And then early 20s. If you like, it's interesting. If I asked you right now, do you think you'll ever have kids? Yeah, you're right. If I would have asked you when you were 19? Do you think you'll ever have kids? What would you say?

Sasha 16:45
I probably would give them the same answer. But without much thought,

Scott Benner 16:51
Ah, I say, I always find that there's that like, early 20s time, where people are just like, don't really consider much beyond themselves. I guess. Like, it's a real exciting time. Like, I'm young, and I'm entering the world, and I'm doing this thing. And it's not till you usually get into your mid like 2526 where you start thinking like, I wonder if there's more to this. You know, it's just it's very interesting, that kind of swing through there. And I'm so glad you can't see me because for some reason, I'm swinging my hands back and forth. I caught myself doing it. And I was like, no one can see this edit still feels ridiculous. Sorry. And I know apologizing for your part. But it's a really interesting space. Like it is. If I told you you were the 50th person that told me that right around that 23 age, you were like, I wonder if I should be like, doing a better job. It's it's just such a common space for it to hit people. It's very interesting. Were you in school in that time? College?

Sasha 17:50
Yes, university.

Scott Benner 17:51
Do you call it University? I was gonna say,

Sasha 17:54
yeah, yeah, no one really call it school. College.

Scott Benner 17:57
No, say it again.

Sasha 18:00
University. No, no, I

Scott Benner 18:02
mean, you said something that I just didn't understand. Nobody calls it school or college. Oh,

Sasha 18:06
yeah. Nobody really calls it school or college. Yeah. Yeah.

Scott Benner 18:10
I know. I just love it when you guys say that also like it. If you got hurt. And you went to the big building where they take care of people, you'd go to what?

Sasha 18:20
The hospital?

Scott Benner 18:21
Oh, see, you said, Ah, why did you say that? You ruined the whole thing. Sasha. Nevermind, this interview is over. Is it? Is it the British that say hospital and not the hospital? It's Oh, I don't know. Maybe? I've heard that. Yeah, I think it's in the UK where they just say I went I went to hospital or something. I don't know. It sounds odd. Well, yeah. That's my point. There. Their steering wheels are on the wrong side of the car. They don't know what they're doing.

Sasha 18:52
And that was an adjustment as well.

Scott Benner 18:55
Where are your steering wheels? You're, you're all cool. Right on the left? Where I'm left. Yeah, you know, chillin over there. You got to be able to hit the giant spiders before they get you. It's just like Whack a Mole. I would just imagine you running around with the hammer just killing things that are trying to kill you all day. Is it like that?

Sasha 19:12
I mean, I always check the spot as big before I go to the bathroom.

Scott Benner 19:16
I have to say, Wait, do you?

Sasha 19:20
Yeah, just because like I found a couple of homespun in there couple months ago. Okay, so every time I go in now, I just have a look at the ceiling before I sit on the toilet.

Scott Benner 19:30
I appreciate you saying that very much. Because I get notes from people who are like, you know, you just boil things down to the least common denominator and everything in Australia is not going to kill you. Everything in Australia is going to kill you. It's horrible. It's like it's it's a it's a it's it's an island. Nothing can get off of it. You guys are trapped there. You realize that right?

Sasha 19:50
Yeah, well, especially with COVID. Now we're even more trapped than we were before.

Scott Benner 19:53
Exactly. And the real shame of it is the spiders don't get COVID If they did, maybe. I don't know they'd be nicer maybe they just wouldn't feel well, they'd be like, let me leave you alone. I'm just not up to it today, you know? Yeah. Bite me on your ass while you're trying to you know it's not right. Okay, so have you ever looked at a kangaroo and thought I could take that thing and want to take a run at it? Oh no, no, that kill you right those things are nasty

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Sasha 24:02
I mean, you get the friendly ones. And then you get the other side of the spectrum while they can get really nasty.

Scott Benner 24:10
Have you ever flipped the news on at night and heard a story about a rampaging kangaroo?

Sasha 24:18
Yeah, actually, I saw one the other day about three or four kangaroos who walked into a bottle store. Like a bottle shop. A bottle store. A bottle shop? Yes. So where they buy? They sell liquor?

Scott Benner 24:33
Oh, that's what I thought. Okay, sorry. That was a phrase I didn't know. And they walked in. And then the first one, they start telling a joke or because that sounds like the beginning of a joke for kangaroos walk into a bolo shop. And it's not. Did they like go nuts?

Sasha 24:50
Oh, I don't know. I just saw that news article just like that and All right, next thing

Scott Benner 24:55
Sasha I have to tell you that when I say something completely ridiculous and people Oh no, that's happened. I feel like I won something. I don't know. Like, I raised my hands over my head like I finished a race when you were like, Yeah, I see. I've seen that before. I was like, Yes, I know crazy things happen in the world. Why didn't nobody talk about, like, in my mind, you should get on here and go, Hey, Scott, before we get started, did you know that for kangaroos went into a bottleshop think that would be the most important thing to me if I was you. My brain works differently, I believe. Okay, we're getting lost here in the diabetes stuff, but it's okay. We'll find our way. You also, you know, you heard me say, are you nervous? And you won't Yeah, I'm not nervous, as I've done this many, many times. But it does take me a while for me to hear your accent. Right. Right. Okay. So it takes me like, I have to settle into it so that it bounces through my head and I can think while you're talking. I know that might sound strange to people, but I'm not as a I don't want anybody to laugh. But I'm not as good at this when people have thicker, thicker or, or more difficult accents. And Australians trail away in their words sometimes. Like the words disappear, as you're saying them, you wouldn't know this, because you don't hear yourself. Just like I don't hear myself when I say water.

Sasha 26:16
i Yeah, no, no, that's true, actually. Because when I first moved here, I, I didn't have as strong of an accent as I do now. And I, I would I would actually struggle on the standing

Scott Benner 26:31
like Australians, but you hear it now. Okay.

Sasha 26:35
Yeah, because I'm used to it. And I think I've, you know, joined them in the sense I have. But when I moved here I was, yeah, people were confused about my accent because I think I had a mix of black, British and American, a little bit of Australian. Yeah, somewhere. It's just interesting,

Scott Benner 26:53
because you're like, somewhere, and it just kind of goes away, like and so my brains like, What is she saying? Oh, she's saying where I hear it. Now. My brother in law is from Scotland. And when he's talking, all I hear is Ay ay ay ay ay, ay. Like, I just hear noises. I don't even hear words like there are times that I understand the first couple of words, he says, and then I just assume the rest of what he's saying. And then not along where it feels appropriate. He never hears this. There are things I know he thinks he's told me that I don't have any frame of reference for so sorry, Jim, if you're listening?

Sasha 27:30
Yeah, I've done that before. Don't worry. I'm just like, I think everyone does it.

Scott Benner 27:34
Right. He makes this point then he's like, I, I'm like, I don't know what that means. Now, I'm only laughing because I can hear him in my head. I should get a room I'm gonna do next time I'm with I'm just going to get him to say, I'll read him a sentence and have him repeat it back into a recorder and I'll bring it back so you guys can hear it. But you're not gonna understand a damn word. He's saying. That's, it's just really cool. Anyway, I'm getting used to your to your speech pattern. So I'm doing okay. Now. MDI lube, and I'm gonna find it my question. Okay. So I remember back when you said, the doctors were telling you, you're doing well. And I think that's important for doctors to like, listen to, and I now know, there are enough of them listening. Like you guys really have to pay attention to this. Just because Sasha saw a doctor who some people were doing, you know, a one season attends doesn't mean her eight is terrific. You know, like you, you have to stop judging people against each other. Like, I oh, this person has a seven, you're doing great. Well, that person might want a six or a five. And what happened to you when you were told you were doing great? You just accepted? Yeah,

Sasha 28:48
I yeah, I believe them. And for a long time. I think I was in. I think I was in denial, actually. Because everyone was telling me how great I was doing. And so to anyone who'd asked me or Hey, what's that on your hip? I'd be like, Oh, it's an insulin pump. I've got diabetes, but I'm fine. Like, everything's fine. sort of thing. Yeah. And, and it was when I found out about CGM, and I tried one. I was like, Oh, hang on. I'm not fine.

Scott Benner 29:22
Right. Yeah, you mix. Listen. It's a weird thing, right? Like, you're trying to balance, kindness, and empathy. But at the same time, you have to see yourself as a parent of somebody with diabetes, if you're a doctor, like you're trying to help them grow up with it. So it's, you know, if you send your kid out to play a sport, and they suck, are you benefiting them by telling them, they're great? And so I guess if it's a kid who's never really going to play this game throughout their life, and you just want them to feel like oh, I tried and I did. Okay. Hey, that's fine. But there are some people who want to excel and telling them that they're doing great when they're not the holds them back. So you have to figure out who you're talking to, before you say your thing. And it sounds like sounds like you would have been able to reach for more, if you thought there was more to reach for.

Sasha 30:21
Yeah, I think so. It's about balance, right? Like, you gotta, like, I'm not saying they shouldn't tell you, you're doing a great job, but they should definitely still be telling you. Hey, like, there's a lot more that you could be doing. Let's talk about it.

Scott Benner 30:36
Yeah, it all doesn't have to happen in one second. It could have been incremental. It could have been like, Hey, you're doing terrific. I bet you though, if you Pre-Bolus Jamil here, maybe this would happen. I'm fascinated by the Pre-Bolus. Same thing. I think I always will be. I think Pre-Bolus thing knocks a point off your agency, you know about and yeah, the people don't take the time to explain it. So that you could try, like even just Pre-Bolus Singh, half the meal. Like even if you were having 50 carbs, and I said just Pre-Bolus 25 of them and putting the other 25 When you eat. We make a huge difference.

Sasha 31:14
Yeah, I totally agree. I mean, when I first heard about it, I think it was in, in one of the books I was reading, and I brought it up to my inner and I was like, I mean, I read this, like, what, what do you think? And she was like, oh, no, we don't usually tell you guys to do that. Because then you go low. Alright,

Scott Benner 31:38
we don't usually tell you guys, because it's a lot of work for us to explain it to you. So why don't you just have poor health instead? Okay, see you next time. Thanks for coming. We appreciate the money. I'm gonna go buy a car with it. Thanks, doc. big help to me. Hopefully one day I'll be able to drive a car if I can see. No thanks to you. It just really is. It's kind of interesting. And also, I've never said this before, Sacha. But I'm gonna say it here. I'm freaked out that Pre-Bolus thing is even a word. Like why do you need a word for doing something correctly? Like you drive a car? Right? Yeah. Okay. Do you step on the brake? The split second before you're about to hit something? Or do you brake prior to getting to the thing?

Sasha 32:30
Yeah, you brake prior.

Scott Benner 32:31
Do you think we should call it pre braking?

Sasha 32:36
That's a good point. I've never thought about

Scott Benner 32:38
why. That's how insulin works. So when you tell somebody to count your carbs, start eating and Bolus, you're you've started off explaining the incorrect way to use insulin. Like we've somehow because because so many people out of fear have told people to use insulin incorrectly. We have to have a name for how to do it correctly. To talk people into it. It has to sound fancy. And by the way, whoever came up with Pre-Bolus That is a very basic term. It's so lame. And I mean, basic the way the kids would say, You know what I mean? Like, you could have come up with something better, like we should have, it should have a fancier name is what I'm saying. Like pre what would you call it? I don't know. I hadn't thought about it before Sasha, no, you're gonna put me on the spot like this. Jesus? I don't know. We'll have a contest. And we'll have somebody come up with a name for I don't know, I don't know. I mean, it's just, it's not you're not Pre-Bolus thing. You're Bolus thing. And if the insulin takes a half an hour to start working, or 20, or whatever it is, well, then Damn it. That's, that's not a special thing. That's the way it's supposed to happen. Again, it's not called pre braking. It's, it's your braking, you're stopping your car. So I don't know. Like, that just never makes sense to me. I've never articulated it before. But I'm upset that it. It got put into practice incorrectly. And so that we had to then talk people into doing it correctly. I don't know. It's bothersome to me. But anyway, you went to the doctor with the book. And you were like, Hey, Gary says I should probably Pre-Bolus at the doctor's like, No, we don't do that.

Sasha 34:17
Yeah, pretty much.

Scott Benner 34:18
What did you do then?

Sasha 34:21
Oh, I went home and did it anyway. I think that you have to, right. I mean, if if they're not willing to talk you through the ideas that you just found out about? Then you got to take it into your own hands. I guess.

Scott Benner 34:38
You don't have to tell me specifically but what do you do for a living?

Sasha 34:42
I'm a student. Okay. That didn't

Scott Benner 34:45
help me. Damn it. There's my story. Alright, well, I'll just make something up instead. Sasha students. Alright, hold on. We'll get back to you in a second. I'm just saying imagine being feckless at your job. Like imagine getting up every morning and knowing you're gonna get Have people half of the information? Or some of it, but not all of it? And that when they come to you and say, Hey, I learned this other thing, you would go? Yeah, I wouldn't think about that. If I was you. That's you, anyone who's doing that should look inward. Because there are people in front of you who are looking for help. And you're, you're telling them, it doesn't exist, and then they go out and find it. And then somehow, you're still able to look them in the face and tell them it doesn't exist. I think what happened to you around that is horrible. Really, and I'm not over exaggerating, I think it's lazy. And it's malpractice, in my opinion. So

Sasha 35:39
anyway, and I think it happens to a lot of people,

Scott Benner 35:41
I think it happens to most people,

Sasha 35:43
and, and it makes it normal. So you know, if then you're the odd one out who actually does get all of the proper advice that you need to succeed. Then every everyone is like, whoa, like, where did you come from?

Scott Benner 35:59
And by the way, if you're a doctor, and you're hearing this that makes you upset, just tell people how to handle themselves, and the podcast won't exist anymore. And I won't have anywhere to talk. So there you go, I won't have to, I won't be able to talk about you anymore. Meanwhile, I don't want to obviously, there are a lot of great doctors too. That's certainly the truth. But, you know, just this thing. I think we've gotten to the point where somehow this little story about what happened to you is so commonplace, that we're not outraged by it the way we should be. Your doctor was unwilling to tell you how insulin works. It's the key of how you're staying alive. It's the key to your long term health success. It's the key to your short term health success. It's it's it's a lot. And we're just like, Oh, it doesn't matter. You don't need to know that part. So I'm sorry.

Sasha 36:50
Oh, I was gonna say actually, I always wondered whether I had missed out on some information because I moved. So because I went, I went from going to a doctor, in you know, in the pediatric ward in Geneva, to the adult clinic in a different country. I thought, well, maybe I just missed the transition there. And the information got lost on the way.

Scott Benner 37:18
So like, this really important thing you needed to know was going to be the next thing they told you. But you happen to move in that time. And now it's gone. You missed that opportunity.

Sasha 37:29
Yeah, I mean, I still wonder, maybe that, you know, there's, you know, they give you like, a couple of sheets of paper, or like some kind of like independence package, or whatever you want to call it before you turn 18 to be able to go out and do it on your own.

Scott Benner 37:46
And that actually stuck with you, like there's so see that there's another example of what this does to people. There's this feeling of incomplete that lives in you in an anxious way. Like, I wonder if I'm like, I know, I must be missing something. Or maybe I am like, no one should have to feel that way. around something as knowable as managing insulin. It's, it's not an unknowable thing. It's not it's not like a it's not a big surprise when it goes right for people. And just okay, when it doesn't go, right. Like it's, I don't know, I think that people should have options. And if they can't, if they can't live up to them with good direction, that's a shame. And there should be ways to help those people as well. But everyone else shouldn't suffer. Because you think most people aren't going to figure this out. So we'll just let them all live like this. It's very, um, it's terrible. It is what it is. But I was gonna ask you what you're going to school for? Because I mean, 25 Sounds like you're going to be a brain surgeon. You don't?

Sasha 38:51
Well, actually, math surgeon. So I'm, I'm doing my PhD in, in metabolic neuroscience, and I work with animals.

Scott Benner 39:02
Metabolic neuroscience. What have you just been a you propping me up to this conversation? Sasha, what's going on here? That sounds really like I don't I'm not sure if I know how to spell metabolic. It's got to be in a in there somewhere right near the near the B. No. It's right now. Of course I am. I don't know what you just said. You just said I'm a Space Ranger and I'm trying to figure out what metabolic Doros Jesus I can't find the letters. But Google doesn't even know it's a thing

Sasha 39:41
trying to understand how the brain controls metabolism.

Scott Benner 39:47
Oh, that's important to me. Seriously, I some belly fat I want to go Why are you is that what are you just working on that for me? Or is it for other things too? What do you what What's the idea behind learning about this?

Sasha 40:02
No, it's for other things as well. Um, part of my actually part of my PhD is about understanding how insulin works in the brain, and how it affects not only metabolic functions, so things like blood glucose, as we all know, but also behavior. So that would be like mood and anxiety and depression and memory and those kinds of things.

Scott Benner 40:33
Yeah. So you when, when you hear me talking about like, people getting to feel the way they're supposed to feel that must mean more to you than it does to other people, then?

Sasha 40:45
Yeah, I guess, I think it's, it's an interesting thing, because when you when you say insulin, to the general population, they automatically think blood glucose. And of course, that's, that is what the first thing you should be thinking of. But insulin also has a whole lot of other functions in the brain. So we know that, you know, if you if you disrupt the function of insulin signal in the brain, that can cause issues that can cause depression that can cause anxiety. And a lot of those things can be independent of the effects on blood glucose, which is really interesting.

Scott Benner 41:29
Okay. When it goes far as to impact Alzheimer's and other brain functions like that, or no?

Sasha 41:38
Yeah, definitely. Alzheimer's is known as type three diabetes. So what happens in the brain is pretty similar to what you would see in Alzheimer's. Really? Yeah,

Scott Benner 41:53
I feel like you're going to talk about things I'm not going to be able to understand, but I'm still going to try. So what is like in your mind? What do you hope to learn? or figure out? And why is it important?

Sasha 42:12
So what I've just described here is just one part of my project of my PhD. But essentially, I'm looking at a specific area of the brain and trying to understand how it takes in information about your metabolism. So are you in a calorie deficit? Are you in a calorie excess eye? Is your blood glucose low? Is your local girth high? How does it take in how does your brain take in that information? And then is able to tell you, Okay, this is the behavior that we're going to perform now. Based on that information,

Scott Benner 42:56
and the behavior could be anything from, like something that I see like maybe a person feels hungry because they've got too much insulin in their body. And so they overeat.

Sasha 43:08
Yeah, for example, right? So it could be around food, but it could also be around your mood. So are you going to be more anxious? Are you going to feel depressed?

Scott Benner 43:23
And are those things impacted by more or less insulin?

Sasha 43:30
Well, it gets a bit complicated.

Scott Benner 43:33
Well, the whole thing's a bit complicated. I googled metabolic neuroscience and nothing pops up. Just like Google's like, Hey, you must be you must be talking to somebody smarter than you. Because I don't know what you're talking about here. It's how so so like, so let's pick one thing? Let's pick? I don't know, we'll pick depression for a second. So how would insulin impact depression?

Sasha 44:01
Oh, so I'm not looking at depression specifically. But there are studies showing that if you if, for example, you delete the insulin receptor in the brain. It mean it the effects that that has. So if you do that in mice, you see that these mice then become more anxious and more depressed. In certain specific scenarios.

Scott Benner 44:30
specific scenarios like,

Sasha 44:32
well, if you test them, so we do behavioral tests with the animals to test certain things. So for example, you put the mouse in an open arena, with a big light on top, we know that the mice are afraid of open spaces because they're afraid of potential predators. So then you have a look at where the mice the mouse is going to spend the most of its time and you can analyze that and say, Well, how spending most of its time in the corners of the arena or in the center. And so if it's spending more time in the center, then it's not as anxious.

Scott Benner 45:11
And you can actually see that there's a correlation between that and this insulin receptor. Yes. Wow. Can you impact the receptor?

Sasha 45:21
You can delete it. Sorry. That's, that's what I've been doing for the past few months.

Scott Benner 45:27
So when you take that, so you're taking the receptor away? Do you do it with pharma circles?

Sasha 45:35
With with genetically encoded viruses,

Scott Benner 45:41
okay, so there's a virus that goes in and deletes this on. That's amazing, first of all, and and now you take that away, and that makes the mice more anxious. So you see them in the corners more? Yes. Is there a way to bolster that so that they're braver and sit in the middle and just sunbathe under the light?

Sasha 46:06
That would be cool. I don't know. At this point, I don't know.

Scott Benner 46:11
Right. But that's the kind of things you're trying to, to learn about.

Sasha 46:16
Yes, that's just trying to learn how how it works.

Scott Benner 46:20
Right. So this receptor, is that is it? Are you at the point where you can say, is it overworking and that's making them anxious? Like, should they not be as anxious as they are? Like, they I'm assuming that you're looking for some way for this to translate into like people at some point, like you're not just trying to perfect the mouse population of the planet, unless these mice can kill spiders? And then, of course, let us weaponize them immediately. But

Sasha 46:50
I mean, that would be incredibly scary.

Scott Benner 46:53
Well, you need to be able to pee and peace. Can you imagine if you just had like a little mouse that you released? Nevermind, we're getting down the wrong road? So like, I'm like, what's the impact for people? Like? Are you trying to figure out why people are like, how much impact this has on depression, anxiety, things like that?

Sasha 47:12
Yes, that's one aspect of it. So there are people showing that if you use insulin intranasally so in the nose, that can alleviate some of the effects of depression and anxiety

Scott Benner 47:30
instead of using an injected insulin?

Sasha 47:34
Yes. So essentially bypassing the effect on blood glucose,

Scott Benner 47:38
by effectively. Oh,

Sasha 47:42
yeah. So if you inject it in your blood, if you just get an injection under the skin, then it's going to obviously affect your blood glucose, right? It's going to drop. But if you put it up your nose, depending I think, depending on the dose, or I don't know too much about that. But it's just a study of it. And I thought it was really interesting. But yeah, essentially, you're kind of you don't have that big drop in blood glucose, but you do still have the effects in the brain. And that seems to be showing that people generally tend to feel better. They have more self confidence, they feel less stressed.

Scott Benner 48:21
No kidding. And we should say not to do that. Right. Like because, like, please don't try that. Okay, thank you.

Sasha 48:29
Thank you this at home.

Scott Benner 48:31
It's not like it's not like a thing that like everyone could do. This isn't a controlled lab situation, etc. And one study that's in credible though, so is the see the whole thing, Sasha and if I'm an idiot, you'll stop me. And you'll sound incredibly bright doing it because you have your accent. But I just think of when you look around and you see people who are some are overweight, some are underweight, some people struggle with one thing, some people have anxiety, some people don't. To me, it's all fine tuning inside of your body that we don't understand how to tune right, like we do our best with diet and exercise and supplements, you know, you know, I can bring my vitamin D up with a supplement, like that kind of thing. But there is if there were, if there were knobs on your back there, there would be a fine tuning that would work better for your body than often the fine tuning that you got from nature. Am I right about that in a really strange way?

Sasha 49:33
Um, I guess you guess I think that's a very complicated question. Oh, no,

Scott Benner 49:38
it's incredibly complicated. But if if you could plug a computer into me and somehow magically had readings for all of my settings, where everything was where my iron level is, and and you know, function of my liver and all this and you could just turn knobs and perfect them. Then there would be a more harmonious, like physical life for me if you could do that. And I mean, is that like the end goal of all this is to fine tune people at some point.

Sasha 50:12
Right? I mean, yeah, I guess like if you think about it in terms of, you know, potential therapies for obesity, diabetes and psychiatric disorders, but I think that's way down

Scott Benner 50:26
the line. Oh, no, I don't like, uh, yeah,

Sasha 50:28
I mean, um, yeah, of course, yeah. I'm just, I'm just my, what I'm doing is really just trying to understand how it works.

Scott Benner 50:37
No, no, I mean, yeah, you're in the infancy of something that if we get to the end of it would be a millennium from now, probably. But I mean, it's not, it doesn't make it untrue. That, you know, I could pull any random person off the street and give them a blood test. And while they might be, quote, unquote, in range, they still maybe could benefit from a little more of one thing a little less of another. And that I just think that, how do I mean this, you know, when you see somebody who's just like, jacked up, and they're just like, in amazing shape, and you look at them, and you think like, Oh, my God, I would never be in shape like that. And they're just, they're rock hard. And they everything looks like it works for them. And they go to run, and they run off like a cheetah. And they're not, they're not winded when it's over. And you just think, well, they just want some sort of a genetic lottery. You know what I mean? Like, and then you see another person who doesn't have that ability. That person didn't do anything wrong, or different. You know what I mean? They were just born like everybody else. And I don't know, it's always occurred to me, it's a deeper thought. And it's a little, like, maybe we should have mushrooms to talk about it. I don't know. But just, it just seems to me like, there's an obvious unfairness to being alive. And sometimes when when people like you were looking at stuff like this, I think, Wow, maybe one day, they'll figure out how to turn one of those knobs, you know, anyway, I think it's really cool.

Sasha 52:01
I think I think that's a comforting way for people to think about it. But I think that the environment effects a lot of it. Like obviously, genes, you know, some people, quote unquote, and better genes than others. But how you live, I think, is underrated. Yeah, just where you are and how it affects? Yeah.

Scott Benner 52:27
Like, we could take two babies, and they can be exactly the same. And I can put one of those babies in a middle income household, it's got radon, and I could put one of those babies in an upper income household that doesn't have radon. And if we track them, their health would probably go in two different directions.

Sasha 52:48
Yeah, yeah, exactly. And like you were describing them, God would ricotta ABS will, you know, that person? Obviously, didn't get there. In you know, a couple of days.

Scott Benner 53:01
It's interesting. I, so I like what you just said, when you said, I think people could find that comforting. It felt like what you said was Scott, you're a child, and you think like a child. You were trying to be polite.

Sasha 53:15
Okay, no, I did not mean that. He didn't mean that I was

Scott Benner 53:17
certain that you were like, Hey, idiot. Stop, stop dreaming. That's not how it's gonna work. And I know, a listen, I understand it probably never going to work like that. But it just, it's interesting to think that in a perfect world, it could. I mean, listen, you, you know, you have type one diabetes, they check your vitamin D level. Right. And that's something they don't do for most people.

Sasha 53:46
I actually don't think I've ever had that checked.

Scott Benner 53:48
Really? This Australia's let you down? You should have that checked.

Sasha 53:53
Yeah, I mean, I do take it most days. I do take a supplement most days, but I don't think I've ever had it checked.

Scott Benner 53:59
Okay. Alright, let's have that done. Our next bloodwork because a lower vitamin D level is can be more common with people with type one. Just imagine that like that simple thing, like taking a supplement everyday of vitamin D that could improve your life. And you wouldn't even know to think of it that way. And then think of all the the back say that is true. Say you taking vitamin D would improve your life, but then you go to the store and buy like some crappy vitamin D supplement that doesn't work as well as it should. And so you still don't get the benefit. Like there's so many barriers to success along like everything. I don't know you're making me sad about I don't know how this is happening. I'm so sorry. No, no. I feel like I'm in a sadness matrix. It just it um I think it's from doing the podcast like it. It's sad to me that some people They'll not know how to Pre-Bolus their insulin. It's sad to me to think that your vitamin D level could be lower and it could be impacting your life or that I just saw a person. The other day, who I know is listening to the podcast for a long time, has been struggling with something that was clearly thyroid related, that they didn't realize was thyroid related until they listened to the podcast about the fibroid and then thought, Oh, well, I have those symptoms, I should check. And they checked, and now they're on their way, you know, to getting it fixed. But without a podcast episode would have never thought that the problems they were having were thyroid related. So imagine that imagine you're low on energy, gaining weight. Moody, like all these things are happening to you. But no one will ever figure out your thyroid until you get so sick, that you land at a hospital and they do so many tests. And eventually somebody goes, Oh, look how high their TSH is there they have Hashimotos. It's, that part makes me sad. And I think that might be specifically because of my job. Because I don't think most people think of illness as that. But I always think like there's something you could see or do if you knew to see or do it, it would save you the time. And to meet the times what's most important, like this time that this person spent not feeling well, is lost. And that that bothers me more than anything else. And it has nothing to do with what you're going to school for. But this is where your what your life has led me. So anyway, I'm sorry. I feel like

Sasha 56:40
no, no, I do understand what you mean. Yeah. Um, I think I think it's hard as well, because you don't I think a lot of people, especially at the start after diagnosis, they're not necessarily in the right mindset to absorb all that information anyway. So even if you tell them they might, you know, not remember or not see it as important,

Scott Benner 57:04
right. And that's why it's important to have doctors that don't look at your eight a one C and go doing great Sasha, go get them kit. You need somebody to say how you feeling? Oh, I feel a little tired. Really? Okay, let's figure out why not just have you tried cutting back on potato chips? Like I mean, sure, potato chips, probably not great. But, you know, like, there's never, I guess until you meet a really thoughtful doctor, you don't recognize what it means to not have one. And like, I was lucky enough to meet a woman named Allie Benito who came on and did the thyroid episode, specifically, but she's also my, my, my family, anybody in my family who has a thyroid issue, she's their doctor, and to see somebody, know what they're doing, and be able to test levels and infer things from them and make adjustments to medication, like a ninja, and not make it take eight or nine months for you to feel better. Like that adjustment time when you see your doctor be like, well, let's just try a little more a little like you're ruining people's lives. If you don't know what you're doing like that. Like, let's throw a dart and see if it hits. You're just you're still in days and weeks and months from people and they could get they could get frustrated and just stop trying. And so it's amazing to have someone who can kind of like, like, just dial in right away and know what to do. And I mean, I know every every person can't be like that. But everybody should. Everyone deserves a doctor like that. I guess. They think your story somehow made me upset. It's not your fault. How far off? are you apologizing to me? Stop it. What did you so what do you do with this degree? Like once you get this thing? You get a job somewhere? And what do you what are you hoping to do?

Sasha 58:58
That's a very loaded question. Because I'm asking myself that every day. I don't know. I honestly don't know. I'm, I've got about six to nine months left to be able to finish this PhD. And afterwards, I'm not sure but I am interested in potentially going into clinical trials. Not necessarily anything to do with insulin in the brain. But yeah, working with animals is a very specific job. I feel like I don't always agree with everything that's going on there. So I I don't aspire to work with animals for the rest of my life.

Scott Benner 59:44
Okay, because of how they're treated during testing.

Sasha 59:49
Yeah, yeah, pretty much and I think I also became a vegetarian a couple years ago. So I feel like that doesn't really align with that.

Scott Benner 59:59
How do you handle the spiders now? He's trying to shoo them out the window

Sasha 1:00:05
Okay, spiders are different though. Long in my heart

Scott Benner 1:00:12
there's a level to this vegetarianism for you have any line, the line forms right around a spider near your butt. I got you I level things not you I'd never eat a chicken, but I will squish you. I see I listen, you're not going to get me to argue with you.

Sasha 1:00:37
Oh, look, it's also because, you know, when you when you work with animals, you don't really have a, you don't necessarily have a nine to five Monday to Friday job. You are required to, you know, go in on the weekends and check that they're okay. And I just don't want that kind of responsibility.

Scott Benner 1:00:54
You want your weekends to yourself? Yeah, yeah. What do you do on the weekend?

Sasha 1:01:00
Uh, honestly, it sounds really sad, but I just work.

Scott Benner 1:01:04
Oh, so that's what you're trying to avoid? Like? Exactly. So you want the things you imagine people do on the weekends? That's right, right. Are you going to stay in Australia? Or do you want to go back to France?

Sasha 1:01:17
Um, I think I will go back eventually, in the next few years.

Scott Benner 1:01:22
Interesting. Where's the healthcare system better? For you? Ah,

Sasha 1:01:28
I, I don't know, actually, because I never lived in France as an adult. So I wasn't privy to all of that, you know, insurance healthcare kind of information. For it sounds, I think I think Australia's overall pretty good because a lot of a lot of a lot of things are subsidized, especially insulin, and things like you know, needles and insulin pump consumables and that sort of thing. But, but it is very sad. That CGM is not covered by anyone and Australia.

Scott Benner 1:02:09
Sounds like they're making progress on that. But it's slow.

Sasha 1:02:13
Yeah, it is very slow. I think now, anyone under 21 years of age, or pregnant or thinking of becoming pregnant is able to get CGM for free. But that's it.

Scott Benner 1:02:30
Are you using one? Well, you are obviously because you're looping. So, but you're using the Medtronic one.

Sasha 1:02:37
No, I'm on G six.

Scott Benner 1:02:39
Oh, I'm sorry, the Dexcom and then the Medtronic pump this loopable. Got it? Yes.

Sasha 1:02:46
I'm, I agree with you. I'm not a fan of Medtronic. To be honest. I, I only went to the to the Medtronic one because that's the only one that's loopable. But before that I was using tandem.

Scott Benner 1:02:57
Yeah. i Well, hopefully, they're not listening anymore. Because you said something nice earlier, I don't want them to hear this. And I don't want people who love their, their, their Medtronic pumps to be mad at me, which has happened in the past. So I don't need that. Although it led to a great interview. If you've never heard it, I'll try to find it for you but and tell you privately, because I don't have the information right now. But one time Jenny and I were talking about Medtronic pumps, and Jenny didn't like using it, and didn't have like glowing things to say about it. And then I got this very passionate note from a guy who was like, who loved his pump. And was he was clearly mad. And then I was just like, hey, alright, cool, like, come on the podcast and tell me about it, then we had a great conversation. So it was a it was really interesting. But it was interesting to see that someone felt like that pump meant more to him than it wasn't just an object. Like it was it was a really important thing to him. And he felt like defending its honor was really it was kind of it was amazing, actually, to watch it all play out. And I'm so glad that I didn't just ignore his note or, you know, and when I was younger, I just wanted to like argued with him for fun, but I didn't. I just was like instead let me talk to you and see what's going on here. Anyway, whatever pump you Yes, amazing if it's working for you,

Sasha 1:04:17
i Yes, I can relate to that. I remember being a kid when I first got that pump i i walked out of the hospital with that pump, but I was never actually asked if I wanted to use it. Yeah, or if I wanted to do MDI, but I kept it for so long. And I remember they were trying to push me to get, you know, the newest version, and I was like, No, this is fine. I like this one. Like, I don't like change. Like, this is my palm like I'm keeping it. So yeah, I can relate to to that person that you were talking to. It makes

Scott Benner 1:04:51
me wonder about how because Arden's used on the pod, her whole life and it's disposable. I wonder if it feels differently To her, like, I wonder if it doesn't like she has no real connection to it because the thing that every three days she throws away. Like, I wonder if that like psychologically, yes, a difference or not? I don't know. I'm really like, in my own head this morning. Maybe it was too early for us to do this. I don't know. For me, it's super late for you. But it's I don't know why I'm, I feel like, you know what I'm saying? Okay, sounds like I'm high today. I'm like, like, what about this? Do you think? Just, I'm just very worried about this today for some reason. I'm sorry. If i How are your expectations so far? Is this like, Are you like, God, we didn't talk about any of the things I want to talk about. Are we doing okay?

Sasha 1:05:43
No, no, this has been good. Has it really? Well,

Scott Benner 1:05:47
I can't tell sometimes. Like, I'm having a good time. That's my only measuring stick. Like when I get done. I'm like how I like that. And then I think other people like it, too. But I don't know. It's a crapshoot. I don't actually know any of you who are listening. So it's just my best guess for what's interesting. Like I found this incredibly interesting. So, okay, are you dating at all? Yes, you've okay, even with school? That's possible. And with your weekends taken up?

Sasha 1:06:19
Yes, I've been with my boyfriend for almost three years now.

Scott Benner 1:06:22
Is that boy gonna go to France with you? If you go to France? That's the plan. Wow. He likes you. Okay. All right. Does he speak French?

Sasha 1:06:35
No, he doesn't. I see him trying to tell him to stop. So French lessons on the side. I took

Scott Benner 1:06:42
three years of French Sasha in high school. I know Neph is nine.

Sasha 1:06:49
That's all Yeah, that's no French.

Scott Benner 1:06:51
Yeah, I don't think so. either. That's all I got out of that. I sat in that room for three years thinking, Do not call on me. Please do not call him. Please, please, please don't ask me a question. I was not good at it. I don't think I have the capacity to learn other languages. But it's a my daughter talks about, like when she's younger, she's like, I want to go too fast. She wants to go to school for fashion. And so she talks about New York and France. And she's like, you know, when she was longer? Like if I want to go to school in France, could I? And I'm like, Yeah, of course. Meanwhile, I don't know how to pay for that. And I have no idea if that's actually possible. But what I've learned is that most people, things people say don't actually happen anyway. So it's better just to be positive. Like, yeah, of course you can. But I don't know what she would do if she got there. And, you know, couldn't speak any French? What would you do? Like, what is your? Good?

Sasha 1:07:51
I feel like if you actually move there, you have no choice but to learn it.

Scott Benner 1:07:56
Yeah, you don't know me, I would walk around. Just be the rest of my life. Gandia Has anyone ever noticed you'd be saying this in French? But you know, just you'd be like, do you ever notice that guy? Scott never talks to anybody? It's because I would just be going I don't understand anything. Anyone say? I just I don't know, my brain doesn't do that. Like it wouldn't hear you say a word and hold the thing and eventually learn the word. I mean, maybe it would, but I have no confidence that what I guess I should say.

Sasha 1:08:27
And I think I think most people think about it like that. If they're just trying to learn it in their home country. It's obviously a lot more difficult. But if you are by yourself in a different country, I think that eventually you just kind of learn it somehow.

Scott Benner 1:08:44
How long do you think it'll take your boyfriend before? He's, like, you know, can get by?

Sasha 1:08:52
Oh, tough question. I don't know. You see Australia, right? Yes, yes.

Scott Benner 1:09:00
Would you feel any pressure if you moved him to France to stay with him? Even if you didn't like him anymore? Because you took him to France?

Sasha 1:09:11
Well, I wouldn't take them. I wouldn't take him if I didn't like him.

Scott Benner 1:09:15
No, I understand. That's not what I'm asking you. Hold on Sasha. This is gonna be fun. Don't let me ruin your life though. Okay, stop me if it's getting that. What if you get there? And a couple of years from now. You're like, this boy. Tired of him. Okay. But then your next thought is I moved him from Australia to France. I can't break up with him.

Sasha 1:09:32
See what I'm saying? Yeah, yeah, seriously.

Scott Benner 1:09:36
Just be careful. Okay. When you're when you're mid 20s Nothing makes sense. But you feel like when I was 25 I was like, I understand everything. And then when I was 30, I was like, Oh, my God was 25. I might have been like, like, stupid. So and now I'm 50 and I think I was 40 I was an idiot. So just that keeps happening. Anyway, I don't want to see the guy abandoned in France. That's only speaking seven words and one of them being baguette. You know, they mean, and he's just like, staying alive on bread.

Sasha 1:10:06
I mean, hey, that's all you need, right?

Scott Benner 1:10:09
Don't you wish? Okay, I'm sorry. This has nothing to do with anything. But how come French people eat so much more bread and aren't heavier?

Sasha 1:10:18
I don't know. I'm right. Yeah. I've had a lot of people make that comment to me in Australia. And I don't know.

Scott Benner 1:10:28
Like, if I just moved to France, can I eat more carbs? And I'll be okay. Some to do with how far you are from like, the, the equator

Sasha 1:10:39
maybe it's jeans? Oh, portion sizes? I don't know.

Scott Benner 1:10:42
You know, I'm realizing now because I'm an idiot about most things that France and where I am is probably fairly equivalent distances from the equator. So the joke doesn't even work. But at least I could figure that out reasonably quickly. But no, I'm a bit seriously. Yeah, like, that's fascinating. Like, there's bread with everything, right?

Sasha 1:11:01
Yeah, yeah, pretty much and wine

Scott Benner 1:11:03
and cheese. And if I like that I'd weigh 500 pounds. That seems unfair. Right, do I have to go to France with you? Just to find out if I can eat breaking. Imagine if I showed up and I was like, Alright, let's do this. Sasha, where's the bread? And then like, Okay, have a great time. No, two weeks into it. You'd be like, Scott, you're you're blowing up like a balloon. You have to stop. I'd be 20 pounds heavier. In a week and a half. Trust me. That's amazing. Okay, uh, how is he? So you're right now, I want to finish up with this. So you're looping. Where's your a onesie right now?

Sasha 1:11:43
Um, it's under six.

Scott Benner 1:11:45
Good for you. It's lovely. And prior to that, and was loop. So was the podcast reminded you of things. It sounds like Gary's book got you thinking about it. The podcast kind of the focus for you. The podcast acts as a reminder for you, you learn about loop from the show. And what's the progress of your agency through that time period.

Sasha 1:12:10
I think the biggest change was just getting a CGM and being able to see what my blood sugar was doing in between meals, and that brought it down from like, I think seven to six. Gotcha. All like six and a half around there. Yeah. And, and then getting the pump and looping allowed me to not, I guess not stress about it as much. I feel like when I got this is something I heard a lot of people talk about, but I am when I get first got the CGM. I was just stressed all the time about it. Because obviously, you know, everything is in real time. And you're, you're getting stressed about the direction of the arrows.

Scott Benner 1:12:57
Maybe you should snort some insulin.

Sasha 1:13:04
I'll try that next time.

Scott Benner 1:13:05
As you were saying that my brains like oh god, she's walking right into a joke about the insulin and the nose thing. This is fantastic. It's weird to have to have to to have to have a conversation and direct entertainment at the same time. Like sometimes my brains thinking about two things at once. Maybe I could learn French. But it's just like I was I was really amazed by what you were saying. Yeah, at the same time, I was like, Can I just joke about this them not talk about the joke, but I've broken the third wall down a while ago with you so it doesn't matter anymore. Wow. Okay, so you so that you see your you see your blood sugar's at first. It's anxious to be able to see them. But do you still feel like that now?

Sasha 1:13:54
No, or not as much at

Scott Benner 1:13:57
least we've helped you with that. Because why you're not afraid of Lowe's as much.

Sasha 1:14:03
I was never really afraid of Lowe's. I was more afraid of heights actually. Because, you know, I've ever seen telling you, yeah, if I want CS above a certain number, your feet will fall off or something.

Scott Benner 1:14:19
Okay, but they never said hey, if your blood sugar gets too low, you'll pass out.

Sasha 1:14:24
No interest. I

mean, it was it was kind of implied. But yeah, it didn't seem it didn't seem like as big of an issue because you know, you just eat and Bob's your uncle.

Scott Benner 1:14:42
So two things. First of all, that's interesting, because what it proves is whatever mind set you put somebody in, is where they are. That's where they started. So you, you somebody didn't start off by making you scared of being alone and so you weren't. Right. That's amazing. Did you just say Bob, your uncle? Or did I completely misunderstand you? Your uncle, Bob's your uncle? So that's the same. Yeah. I have no frame of reference for that.

Sasha 1:15:16
It's, you're like, everything's, everything's fine. Like, that's, that's the way it is. sort of thing. That's what it means. All right,

Scott Benner 1:15:25
hold on. Bob's your uncle is a phrase commonly used in Ireland, the United Kingdom in the Commonwealth countries. That means and there it is, or, and there you have it, or it's done. Typically someone says it to conclude a set of simple instructions, or when a result is reached. Bob's your uncle. Gotcha. When you said that I thought I was having a stroke. It was like, Oh, I'm not hearing words anymore. You're sort of reaching for water. I'm like, mid hydrated, maybe I'm dehydrated. And then I thought I'm gonna let it go. And then I'm like, no, no, I gotta find out what that what just happened there. Okay. And so that's just that's just what it is. It is what it is. Gotcha. It is what it is what it is. Okay. Um, I might start saying that I'm making a note here. Also, by the way, congratulation. You named your episode. Great. Bob's your uncle. That's okay. So but but my, my original point, I'm sorry, I'm keeping you long. Are you okay? Yeah, that's fine. Okay. My original point back there was that if a doctor gets you, the first thing they make you afraid of, is the thing you're going to be afraid of? Like, because it seems like they must know something. And it's the beginning, right? So you're like, well, there's this learned person here, who obviously knows way more about diabetes than I do. And this is what they've told me to be afraid of, my feet are gonna fall off, if I let my blood sugar be too high. That's the vibe you got. And you know, if a doctor says, Look, if you get low, you're going to drop dead, you know, that. And that's the vibe you get from somebody, then you avoid the lows. And so by avoiding the lows, you really are making your blood sugar higher, but by being told to avoid the highs, even though you kind of didn't really know what you were doing a whole lot, you still had an A one C in the sevens, which is not bad. You know what I mean? So there's something about that. That was, I think that makes sense. Like when I I'll say on here, like, you know, the saying that most people get is it's better to be high than low. But what I say is, I'd rather stop a lower falling blood sugar than fight with a high one. And I think that, just that, that idea. I haven't said this on the podcast in a long time. But that's my mantra around diabetes, I'd rather stop a low or falling blood sugar, then fight with a high one, if you just come from that perspective, every day. It's an A one C in the sixes. It's just a perspective, it's a perspective thing. So I think it's important about how people talk to you and what they choose to make you aware of. And moreover, maybe it's not good to make people afraid of things, wouldn't it be better just to give them a working knowledge of it? And and then some tools to, to access them? That's how I feel.

Sasha 1:18:26
Yeah, I agree with that. And I think, I think in that sense, looping is is really great, or any kind of algorithm that you can use, because not only is going to is it going to prevent your lows and prevent you from you know, having to stuff your face all the time. But it's also going to start doing the work for you, when you when it sees you going high. So you don't have to wait as long to to act and hopefully the high is not as high later on.

Scott Benner 1:18:59
And I think as the years go on, and we have more time with it, the company should make the stopping of the high blood sugars with the algorithm more aggressive. Because it does need to be pretty aggressive. You can't just you know, you can't do you can't do a slight Basal increase when you know, when you're suddenly 125 Diagonal up because you missed on your meal Bolus by 20 carbs. Like that's not gonna, I mean, it might keep you under 200 But it's not gonna. It's not gonna just bring your right back again. So as that gets and loop those that are using what version of loop are using

Sasha 1:19:36
I'm not using the automatic small boluses okay,

Scott Benner 1:19:39
why? Alright, so you're you're just adjusting Basal for you. Yeah, it is. Arden's is the auto Bolus one. It's really cool. It's just like you can mess up in 10 minutes later, you get a diagonal up arrow and the things like more here I'll give you more. It's it's still could be more aggressive. But It's, it's, uh, it's amazing, it's a, it's a window into what I think retail, retail available systems are going to be, you know, in the coming years, I'm just super excited to for everybody's to be on the market and for people to learn how to use them. Because I think for most people, they're going to be incredible improvements. So, you know, now if you've got a five, five, a one C, you might not want that. But if you're a person walk around with an eight and a half and slapping an algorithm pump on, you could bring you to a mid six, or even i Six, it's a big improvement for you. Out of nowhere, you know,

Sasha 1:20:36
honestly, if even if you have a low A one C, it's, it's still going to be an improvement, maybe not in a numbers, but the mental load.

Scott Benner 1:20:48
I agree with you. Like there may be people who are willing to say, look, I have a five, five, but I'm going to switch to this algorithm and not have to worry about this as much and have a six, three, and just be like, hey, whatever this is trading a little bit here. I also think, and I'm excited to get Omnipod, five for Arden so I can really find out. But I also think there's going to be ways to do I want to say manipulate, I think there's going to be ways to use the insulin within the algorithm that will lead to the lower a one sees even lower than what the algorithm is shooting for through the F like through the FDA guidelines. I'm not certain, but I'm excited to try it. So I think it's possible because you hear people manipulate control IQ, right? With tandem and and get better outcomes than I think what the algorithms written for so there's got to be a way I'm, I can't wait. And and especially as Arden's leaving for college, I love loop, but Arden's not gonna build a app on her laptop. I don't think you know what I mean? Like, I'm trying to imagine her away at university. And she, you know, like, hey, my app needs to be rebuilt. I'll do it. Like, I'm not certain. That's her vibe.

Sasha 1:22:05
It's a big commitment. Yeah. And I think if you're not if you're not involved from the get go, it's kind of hard to just forced into it later.

Scott Benner 1:22:14
Yeah. I listen, I barely understand it. And there are people who helped me when I like, help me please. Like and that's just, you know, I get it. I know those people because the podcast or I don't think I'd, I mean, honestly, you heard me say enough. After three years of French that's not even correct. Like, the one thing I think I know isn't even right. So he imagined me like learning the loop out like stuff wouldn't go well. This is the thing right here. Talking about killing spiders. And whether or not you can kick kangaroos asked like stuff like that. It's more my speed. So isn't it weird now that you've talked to me in person that I end up that I understand diabetes in the way I do? Right? Yeah, makes sense? No, does it just feel like you just met like a homeless person who like understands rocket science? You're like, Wait, I don't understand, like, how did you end up in this situation? If you know how to get a rocket into space? Like there's this one thing I'm really good at and everything else. I'm just very average, I guess.

Sasha 1:23:16
I think you're very good at making parallels. With your random everyday examples that happened to you.

Scott Benner 1:23:26
It really is my only skill. Please don't tell people it makes me seem very basic. Which

Sasha 1:23:31
I No, no, I didn't. I didn't say that was your skill. But I did say it was a skill,

Scott Benner 1:23:35
it might be my skill. It might be my only skill that I hear something. And that I have so much trouble understanding it that I just turn it into a pictogram in my head. And then I can in a fun way, describe it to you in a way where you can remember it. Like it works in this scenario. But like, imagine if you and I were dating, and like something came up that I didn't understand that I started telling some long s3 to get to the point you'd be like, Oh my god, I gotta get rid of the sky. Don't you think that you think my wife downstairs is like right now? It's gonna come explain something to me. It's gonna take way more words than you. Do you know that? I don't think of you as the age you are because of your accent.

Sasha 1:24:24
Really? Yeah. Sound old.

Scott Benner 1:24:27
It's just older. It's there's something about the British and or Australian vibe. That makes you feel like you're in your 30s you own your home and you've got stuff together.

Sasha 1:24:37
Oh, man, I wish

Scott Benner 1:24:42
it could just be me. But that's how it feels to me. Like I have to I've had to remind myself that you're 25 a number of times while you're talking.

Sasha 1:24:53
That's okay. That makes me feel better actually.

Scott Benner 1:24:55
Does it really? Yeah. Why do you think

Sasha 1:24:59
it's so As a compliment, if you sound more mature than you are, right,

Scott Benner 1:25:04
you seem together to me. But I don't know if you're not going to get off this podcast and like, do a line of coke and then drink a fifth of whiskey. I'm like, I don't know who you really are, don't me like, but in this conversation, you plus your Australian like, I feel like you're gonna go outside with a bat and just like Murad or something. That's probably not really what Australia is like, right?

Sasha 1:25:25
No, not really. I mean, if you live out in the bush, maybe

Scott Benner 1:25:31
I have no perspective. I almost made it to Australia one time. There's a group of type ones that wanted to bring me down there to give a talk. And we just couldn't pull the finances together because of the long trip and everything and the expense. But I was excited to try it. But I don't think it's ever gonna happen because I'm old. And now everybody does everything over zoom anyway. You know, so

Sasha 1:25:54
Oh, I mean, Coronavirus ever has an end, I reckon you'd be able to pull it off. I think honestly, there's a lot of people. As you said, there's a lot of Australians listening to the podcast, I think, I think it would be really useful.

Scott Benner 1:26:10
If I had, I'm gonna end with this session. Because I have to let you go. Because it's 1222 where you are. And I assume you have to get up in the morning. If I had like a big pile of money, and I didn't know what to do it like if somebody came along and was like, Scott, we think you're doing a great job with the podcast, here's $2 million to do whatever you want to help people with type one. I do you think that part of what I would do would be to travel to like some places to just talk. I don't want to talk to doctors and people who talk to people about diabetes, I'd love to explain to them, like the what I found works, talking to people. And there's some places that have supported the podcast. So greatly like I would love to visit. Australia is definitely one of them. The United Kingdom is really supportive of the podcast, like I'd love to go there. It's got a very interesting following in South Africa. The show, which is always really interesting to me, and then I just would love to just bop around the United States and, you know, do a talk and go and see if we couldn't help some people and get people talking about diabetes in a different way and get doctors thinking about stuff. Beyond just what's easy in the moment and lumping everybody together into one pile and least common denominator. You know, teaching I'd love to talk about that a little bit, but I'm just gonna keep doing it here. Because like you said Coronavirus and money, etc. But I'm really thrilled you found the show and that it's helped you at all, like you've really sound like your your life's on its way. It's cool. You feel good?

Sasha 1:27:45
Yeah, yeah.

Scott Benner 1:27:47
Good for you. Are you more hopeful about your life than you were five years ago?

Sasha 1:27:54
With diabetes, diabetes? Yeah. Yeah, I think I think as you said, as, as those algorithms keep getting better and better. I'm just, you know, hoping that one day I'll find the perfect one that suits my lifestyle.

Scott Benner 1:28:14
Keep looking, because, um, yeah, seriously, like, don't get don't get complacent. I think there's a fine line between not being complacent and not switching just to switch. You know what I mean? Like, you don't just like just don't get a new pump. Like because a new like, you know, some people are like, oh, a new phone, and they just get it. Like, you know, but don't stop looking. And I think really believe that this stuff's going to get better and better as time goes on. And I hope the companies listening are it would be nice if they did the same thing. If they didn't just say, well, this is good. We've improved things for people good enough. Like if they really just pushed forward to see what what they could do and be brave about it. You know, there's, there's people out there who already know how to do this stuff. Like, you don't have to reinvent the wheel. Go find them. And bring it bring this stuff to the masses. That'd be really cool. Yeah, yeah. All right. Well, I really appreciate you doing this. You were terrific. I was silly. And I appreciate you putting up with me. So thank

Unknown Speaker 1:29:20
you. Well, thank you for having me.

Scott Benner 1:29:24
Oh, I'm sorry. I feel like I want to apologize to you. I don't know what that means. I guess we'll find out when I listen back and edit it later. I'll be like, Oh, I did. I did. Oh, that girl apology. I don't know. No, no, no. Are you sure? Okay, good. Yeah. A huge thank you to one of today's sponsors, G voc glucagon. Find out more about Chivo Kaipa pen at G Vogue glucagon.com Ford slash juicebox. You spell that GVO ke GL you see ag o n.com. Forward slash juicebox. Fun fact, this show was also almost called rampaging kangaroo. There's a lot of quality opportunities here to name the podcast. Hey, I'd like to thank the Contour Next One blood glucose meter and remind you to go to contour next one.com forward slash juicebox

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